DGIII alpha release available part 3 (CLOSED)

[Arkalius]

Controlling landing vert speed with keyboard controls is tough but I managed a nice -2m/s after a
nice reentry... I like the DG3

[DanSteph]

I'll write down all your remark/bug comment when I'll be back home...

Just a few add:
Matt: yes a button next "cockpit open" labeled "force unlock"
it may have a cover or not and would override the lock light
(of course I'll resolve the "earth" bug first)
I can add a warning sound and a message:
"WARNING computer safety override"
So you'll still be able to open the cockpit in space


About RCS/surface I'll lower the value below the stall speed (120 m/s ?)
so switch should not happen during a normal flight condition.
It will also always reverse to surface control if on ground.
Anyway there is still an unwanted feature from Orbiter, we are
not allowed to modify the surface position other than trim so if
you are pulling the joy and it suddenly change to RCS the surface
stay pulled... If I cannot find a way to get ride of this I'll reverse
to the old "switch at given pressure (not dynpressure)".

About landing gear there is 3 light on the DISP 3 that show if they
are open or closed. (3 green)


Dan

[DanSteph]

and now a little quiz:

What's the difference beetween the two image




(work in progress)

Dan

[Orbiter Fan]

Where did pilot go?? I sure hope that the DGIII is running on an autopilot there!

[DanSteph]

Sure


I hacked the model in an attempt that the model's visual
match the number of passenger as well as if the pilot is here or not.
(safe mode)

I try to do the pilot in 3dmax but there is at least two years that I didn't
worked on max... and appart a litle try I never modeled for Orbiter.

Time to learn...

Dan

[Leemon]

Dan --

Here is the scenario that I spoke of in my last message.  I hope that it will help you in your
debugging.  Even though the DGIII is in safe mode, the low fuel alert sounds and cannot be shut
off without starting the APU.  Also, please note that you can't do things like accelerate time, and
that every key press, even outside the DGIII causes the same error beep that you get when you
try to click a button inside.  

Lee
---------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN_DESC
Contains the latest simulation state.
END_DESC

BEGIN_ENVIRONMENT
  System Sol
  Date MJD 60268.0701484283
END_ENVIRONMENT

BEGIN_FOCUS
  Ship GL-01
END_FOCUS

BEGIN_CAMERA
  TARGET GL-01
  MODE Cockpit
  FOV 50.00
END_CAMERA

BEGIN_PANEL
END_PANEL


BEGIN_SHIPS
GL-01:DeltaGliderII
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.5740473 28.4645426
  HEADING 305.65
  PRPLEVEL 0:0.057 2:0.983
  NAVFREQ 94 492
  XPDR 0
  MeshSkin DeltaGliderII
  NOSECONE 1 1.0000
  GEAR 1 1.0000
  AIRLOCK 1 1.0000
  COCKPIT 1 1.0000
  PRADIATOR_PROC 1 1.0000
  StartPower_ext 2
  StartPower_batt 0
  StartPower_cell 0
  Apu_start 0
  Gen1 0
  Gen2 0
  GenSelector 0
  PowerHud 0
  PowerMfd 0
  PowerRadio 0
  PowerAirlock 0
  PowerEngine 0
  PowerLifepack 2
  PowerAp 0
  PowerMainBus 0
  PassengerSeat 0
  Strobe 0
  HydGearPress 0
  LevelBatt 100.0297
  Emergency_power 10000.0000
  VoltageStartBus 48.0000
  VoltageGen1 0.0000
  VoltageGen2 0.0000
  VoltageGenBus 96.0000
  ExtFuelHatch 0
  ExtFuelValve 0
  DockFuelValve 0
  FuelInputSelector 0
  XFeedFuel 0
  DumpMainFuel 0
  DumpRcsFuel 0
  HoverValve 0
  MainValveL 0
  MainValveR 0
  RcsValve 0
  AirIntake 0
  TurboPump 0
  ComputerDisplay 0
  HudMode 0
  O2tankALevel 63.3292
  N2tankALevel 100.0000
  O2tankBLevel 100.0000
  N2tankBLevel 100.0000
  DockInputValve 0
  ExtInputValve 0
  InputSelector 0
  ButtonTankAO2 2
  ButtonTankAN2 1
  ButtonTankBO2 2
  ButtonTankBN2 1
  ButtonAFan 2
  ButtonAFilter 2
  ButtonACooling 2
  ButtonAMoist 2
  ButtonBFan 0
  ButtonBFilter 0
  ButtonBCooling 0
  ButtonBMoist 0
  Radiator 1
  ShipControl 5
  LifeDisplay 3
  CabinO2Level 21.3986
  CabinCO2Level 350.0558
  CabinTempLevel 12.5952
  CabinPressure 14.6988
  CabinMoistLevel 42.0575
  CabinDustLevel 0.0002
  CabinO2Setting 22.6952
  CabinTempSetting 21.2000
  CabinPressSetting 14.7000
  O2ConsumptionSetting 1
  PassengerNumber 2
  PilotName Lee_Golden
  PilotAge 42
  BasePilotPulse 73.0000
  Passenger1Name Virenz_Laureline
  Passenger1Age 22
  Passenger1BasePulse 67.0000
  Passenger2Name Proud_Christine
  Passenger2Age 28
  Passenger2BasePulse 71.0000
  FailGearFailure 0
  FailGearCollapse 0
  FailLeftMainEngine 0
  FailRightMainEngine 0
  FailHoverEngine 0
  FailRcs 0
  FailSurfaceControl 0
  FailComputer 0
  FailComputerBlueScreen 0
  FailAutopilot 0
  FailExtRadiator 0
  FailAirbrake 0
  FailNoseCone 0
  FailCanopy 0
END
END_SHIPS

[bheick]

Hey, Just a suggestion, an a wish;

 Can the power bus be placed on a separate power breaker panel and limited to a safe voltage. I
was thinking that if the voltage limitations were set and exeeded, the braker would pop and
power down the ship to protect the APU on a timed reset or a manual one. Now with that Occuring
you would either have to power the ship using the Emergenccy power cell, or a bakup Battery, like
the one on board.


Just thinking here

Love The new DG Dan, completley blown out of my seat )


Brian

[ENS2018]

Hey Dan,
I just encountered a small bug in the sys-check while coming in to dock with ISS.  When in Linear
RCS mode the sys-check will display "ship control not on RCS".

I also tried docking with the Nose Cone closed and was impressed with the failure.  Not only does
it malfunction, but you've simulated the impact forcing the cone open part way (60%), good
job.

Lastly, a quick question, I'm looking in the scenario file for a quicksave I made.  Which value will
allow me to disable the APU (make it malfuntion), I didn't see a FailAPUFail or whatever it may be
called.  Can you help me out?  


Lee:
Strange, I just just tried Orbiter with DGIII and Helios.  I docked DGIII with Helios (in earth orbit),
and then put DGIII into "safe" mode.  After that I switched to Helios, and made a burn towards
the moon.  After a bit I started accelerating time up to 1000x.  I then went back to 1x for orbital
insertion/stabilizatoin, switched back to DGIII, powered up, and landed at Briton Beach.  I noticed
some of what you were talking about when I couldn't quicksave while DGIII was in "safe" mode,
but all I had to do was switch to Helios to make the quicksave.  Did you try switching to another
craft and get the same error?

Later,
Tony

[DanSteph]

Leemon,

Thanks , I know exactly what happen in safe mode, in order to forbid each
button appart the APU START I block every  button and also keystrock
I had to allow some as F1 F2 etc etc but I forgoted CTL-S and some other
I'll do it in a different maner because there is just too many keystroke.

That's why you get all some trouble with the safe-mode.


Don't worry I'll write down all your bug report, (btw thanks for reporting)
there is no  release tonight because I'm too busy acking the mesh model...

After 3 hours of try I have now full access to it
 I'll ask the permission to frying tiger to modify it so I'll be able
to bring even more stuff in the future release.

I hope it will say "yesssss"

Dan

[DanSteph]

While I'm here, why not that also:


Dan

[Leemon]

Re the exhaust nozzles:

What an improvement!  Looks great...

Lee

[MattNW]

What's going to trigger the pilot disappearing? Is there going to be an ejection seat?

"Ladies and gentlemen, we have just lost all power and life support. If you see me punch out,
don't worry. I am going for help."



I get the same thing as ENS2018:

The configuration check seems to ignore anything but "Auto Mode". Unless in Auto it reports that
you aren't in RCS Mode even when you have RCS Lin or Rot selected.


reekchaa

Are you saying you want to inteview female robots?


After extensive testing I judged the DG III fit with only a few minor "downs" (nothing that can't be
fixed in route to Ur) and resumed my exploration of the Al Farkadon system. I launched from
Lowland on Astoria, docked with Vespucci and put the ship into Safe Mode. Ready to depart for
the moons of Ur.

[Neal]

Dan, thanks for DGIII. It's amazing. Have a little bug nobody else has mentioned, I think. When refueling
on the ground (haven't tried it docked yet), you can open the dump vent for a moment while refueling is
taking place, then close the dump valve, and the refueling process is suddenly complete. In other words,
you don't have to wait for minutes while your empty tanks are being filled. Just open the vent for a
second or two, close it, and your tanks are full. Actually, in a way, it's rather nice, not to have to
wait for refueling to complete, but not realistic. I'd rather have realistic. But this isn't what I'd
call a serious bug.

On another note -- I don't know if this is unique to DGIII or not, but when I opened my "current state"
file, all the DGIIIs I had in the scenario were saved with "RPOS, RVEL, AROT, VROT" coordinates and the
status was "Orbiting", even though they were dead still on the ground. The scenario I was running at that
current state starts our with each one having the status "Landed" with lat/lon coordinates. I didn't
operate any of the DGIIIs during the scenario. All I did was start the scenario, and then immediately
exit Orbiter. In the same scenario file, I had a couple Shuttle PBs landed as well. Unlike the DGIIIs,
they kept their "Landed" status with lat/lon coordinates in the "current state" file. Not a big deal, you
might say. But it's been a little tricky trying to make a scenario file with DGIIIs precisely placed.
When I check my "current state" file to see what the current latitude and longitude is for one of my
DGIIIs, it shows as RPOS, RVEL, AROT, VROT coordinates. Don't know if this is a DGIII issue or an Orbiter
issue. Any enlightenment, thoughts, advice, etc. is appreciated.

Neal

[spets]

the new exhuast looks awesome dan! can't wait for future model hacks!

[ENS2018]

In response to the new exhaust vents all I can say is: Wow

Keep up the good work Dan.

~Tony

[reekchaa]

Matt,
I was thinking the onboard Computer could evolve into something in line with SAL.. HAL's counter-
part from 2010.   ..I'm sure 'voice commands' aren't too far off now, eh?  
Although now that Dan has full access to the model, I'm just torqued over all the new Possibilities,
as I'm sure Dan is too..  JUST THINK what he can DO now!  
Looks Great!

[MattNW]

reekchaa wrote:

> Matt,
> I was thinking the onboard Computer could evolve into something
> in line with SAL.. HAL's counter-
> part from 2010.   ..I'm sure 'voice commands' aren't too far
> off now, eh?  
> Although now that Dan has full access to the model, I'm just
> torqued over all the new Possibilities,
> as I'm sure Dan is too..  JUST THINK what he can DO now!  
> Looks Great!
>
>


I'm afraid of what Dan's going to do now.

If you want some good robotic voices try one of MS Client Character voice editors. It has all kinds
of voices you can plug in and then output as .wav files. It even lets you do some editing of the
sound properties.

[DanSteph]

Neal: Orbiter's 'bug' (feature) already explained : when you use zero thruster
to make smoke or light even if it don't have any power, Orbiter consider
that while thruster is On it must switch from "on ground" to "on flight" computation.
It cause several problem and need several workaround... but it work: smoke and light.


About the mesh , I'm very excited by the possibilities howewer
there is two problem:
1-Roger didn't reply to my mail yet to give his grant to modify it, (what if he say "no?")
2-The time....  I'm already 8 hours per day at least on the DG's code
and modelling take time also...


Hurry hurry, I go back home now


Dan

[Foxboy]

Hi Dan! Great Work.

1st: I did a reentry to KSC using the Shuttle 3.2 Reentry MFD (with Entry Trajectory and HAC
Horizontal Display). But: when I tried to use it, the Reentry (Heat) Display of the DGIII would
always change to AP Program Display.
To fly the Shuttle trajectory, DG must use 20-30° AoA. No way with 40° like the Shuttle. Wouldn't it
be great if the DG had it's individual reentry trajectory display?

2nd: During Reentry, DGIII produces more Drag with 30° AoA than 40° AoA. This should be vice
versa. Drag should increase with AoA. But somewhere between 20° and 40° Drag decreases.
Somehow strange. Also, when AoA drops below 30°, the Autopilot is not able to get back up to
40°.

3rd: The RCS / Control Surface switching shouldn't be XOR. It would be better if the auto mode
would just support the control surfaces with a little RCS input depending on dynamic pressure.
Display would say "RCS assist".

Fox

[DanSteph]

Spets:
reviewed some message to track about bug report when I saw you temperature concern.

I study many document about temperature at high altitude and high speed
it's a very difficult subject even the X-15 calculus vs mesured data  where wrong by more than
200C° on some point of the body.

First the concorde data are very succint, which altitude ? wich external temperature ?
pressure ? also the temp depend in a great manner from the shape of the vessel due to the
supersonic shockwave. The concorde shape is optimised for supersonic speed while
the DG doesn't seem at all. (it doesn't even have the body of a supersonic plane
(must be like a woman shape don't know the word, that was discovered in years 50 I think)

I had some discussion on some physic forum it's not an easy subject at those temp
pressure and speed things behave strangely...  

Anyway I don't think the temp are completely messed for now... they "look" "about" right
and the calculus take about no time while even the nasa can give wrong result
with a powerful computer that will run a program during hours to give just a
temperature profile.

Just two cents of course

Dan

[DanSteph]

fox, I will look al this later I'm not in a "reentry brain mode" today
Thanks for input anyway.

Dan

[Spets]

Dan,

I just wasn't certain whether you just picked out a formula out of your butt or happened to
research the temperatures a bit (kidding, kidding)

I was just pointing out a difference I found, glad to hear you had it looked at before. good luck
with getting the Ok from Roger, I'm getting scared to think what you might do to the DGIII!

Spets

[Dave Grover]

Spets:

I know what fuselage shape you are talking about.  American supersonic fighters from the 1950s
and 60s, such as the F-105 Thunderchief, had this fuselage shape.  The technical term for this
shape was a "coke bottle" fuselage!    Can you see why?  LOL!

Dan, thanks so much for all this free work you are doing for us.  In previous versions of Orbiter, the
DGII was the addon-of-addons, IMHO.  You are severely wowing us with the DGIII!  

Do you ever feel like this upgrade may be your life's work?  

Grover,  used to be Dave.

[FetDaniel]

I noticed an error on the engine display on the middle panel. When burning 100% forward and
backwards the same amount of kn is displayed. :P

[DanSteph]

"houston, we are go for mesh modifying"

Roger long (frying tiger) kindly gave the permission to  modify the mesh
Thanks to him.

COOOOOOOOOOL !

Dan