weapons in Orbiter

[Me]

yes that would be nice but before I could run that i would need some serious upgrades to my computing power

[StarLost]

Ghostrider wrote:


Especially since as you get older, chasing pretty girls can get you arrested.

Only if it screams to the cops ... or its mother.


Really.  Did your father never tell you that no matter what age a woman achieves,  there is still an eighteen year old girl
trapped inside her?

Someday you will learn to find depth in a woman, not just the superficial aspects.  Mind you, usually by the time you do, you
understand what it means for the old dog to chase and  finally catch that car...  now what the hell do you do with it?

and to paraphrase a Heinlein quote (from "The Number of the Beast") : "our fault was not in giving them the vote, or letting
them out of the kitchen; it was in teaching them to talk."

[Ghostrider]

Someday you will learn to find depth in a woman, not just the superficial aspects.  Mind you, usually by the
time you do, you understand what it means for the old dog to chase and  finally catch that car...  now what the hell
do you do with it?

Dude, I'm 36 and married.

Been there, done that. I'm happy to have caught the car. It's been worth chasing. And syncing, of course.

[DocHoliday]

hehe, yeah, I too have zero bad experience with women, but StarLost had a worse version of it, so I perfectly
understand his opinion on the subject even though I don't agree with it I think we should've given women full
equality from the start.. and the world would either be a more peaceful place or wouldn't exist anymore

Ghostrider wrote:
Watched it too! Shane was a hotter! I can just imagine Colonel McQueen's briefing in ORBITER: "Allright, guys.
We're
going in on DGIIIs from the dark side. It's gonna be a real knife fight, so check your six. We'll use some aerobraking
and maybe a PRO200 program or two. And one more thing, if your nose heats up to 2000 °C on re-entry and the
autopilot goes offline, it's OK to be scared." Everybody else: "Hoo-ha!"

hehe, THAT was the my favourite scene, especially when you imagine McQueen as a plumber That.. and the scene
where he dogfights with Chiggy von Richthoffen (pardom my spelling)

Anyway, let's concentrate on recon: that could be done right now. Besides taking pictures of ground installation, one
cool thing would be to take pictures of a missile test - which is where a script would be useful. You get briefed about
the predicted launch time and you have to make into orbit so that your cameras can image the missile's flight. For
scoring, what about posting the pictures and see who's the best snoop?

Well.. let me think. This COULD actually be done as things are now....
1. You get RedShift and program a missile for launch at a specific time, plus orbit and other stuff that it needs to do.
2. You record a custom undocking sound for a station of your choice, so when you undock, you get the briefing..
3. Alternatively OR additionally, you can use the seqence editor and get the whole story and running instructions as
the mission progresses.... (the sequencer in OS3.0 fully supports time compression, so the instructions can be far
appart)

Of course, the zoom problem sort of defeats the purpose..

And I also miss the option to "fix" VC view to an external target. Like you can do in most combat sims. You select a
target and have your "virtual head" follow it as you fly around it... you know what I mean the same kind you have
in external view under Target to.. and Target from...

This and some zoom thingy, the same kind it is used in external view.. Now if you could also adjust your zoom factor
using mouse wheel, it would almost feel like a sniper rifle

Cheers,
Janez

[Ghostrider]

DocHoliday wrote:

I think we should've given women full equality from the start.. and the world would either be a more peaceful
place or wouldn't exist anymore

We should have left them full mastery of the planet, so we little men could devote our lives to art, poetry and beer.

hehe, THAT was the my favourite scene, especially when you imagine McQueen as a plumber That.. and the
scene where he dogfights with Chiggy von Richthoffen (pardom my spelling)

Yeah, and he goes: "Well, I don't think our maker wants to hear from me right now. Because he know I'm going to go
out in this plane and I'm going to remove one of His creations from His universe. And when I get back, I'm going to
drink a bottle of scotch as if it was Chiggy Von Richtofen's blood and celebrate his death."

Go, Tyrus, go!
Wait - the Hammerhead! Why no Hammerhead add-on?

This and some zoom thingy, the same kind it is used in external view.. Now if you could also adjust your zoom
factor using mouse wheel, it would almost feel like a sniper rifle

Cool, but rifle scopes do not zoom. They're fixed. They're not even cross-shaped, more like T-shaped. They almost
always get them wrong in movies.

Now that we speak of it, cameras are cool and more sensors would be better. Maybe a radar, there is already a
proximity radar as standard and the Dragonfly and Helios have radars, but a true radar like the F/A-18's APG-73, with
multiple target detection. Not just for tactical stuff, mind you. A radar is always a useful thing to have...

[andyman]

Yeah, radar is very useful for docking to random objects and putting them together, or avoiding an object.

[DocHoliday]

Ghostrider wrote:
We should have left them full mastery of the planet, so we little men could devote our lives to art, poetry and beer.

That doesn't sound like a bad way of living, but we both know, it wouldn't work that way

Yeah, and he goes: "Well, I don't think our maker wants to hear from me right now. Because he know I'm going
to go
out in this plane and I'm going to remove one of His creations from His universe. And when I get back, I'm going to
drink a bottle of scotch as if it was Chiggy Von Richtofen's blood and celebrate his death."

Amen! You're only the third person I know, who watched and loved this show..   Seems like NOONE knows about it.
ahh.. I'm gonna whip out my CDs now, gotta watch some of those

Go, Tyrus, go!

"T.C. stands for Tyrus Cassius?" "Oh? I always thought it stood for Top Cat."

Wait - the Hammerhead! Why no Hammerhead add-on?

The hammerhead was made for FS2004, not for Orbiter though.. Reason? Read a few lines back
Here, so the rest of you will know what we are on about:
http://www.cyberpursuits.com/heckifiknow/saab/vids/saab40.wmv

I liked the ISSAPC though.. The Shuttle-A or Eagle reminds me a lot of those, but it's not quite the same
http://www.cyberpursuits.com/heckifiknow/saab/vids/saab62.wmv

The physics aspect of this show was probably the worst I've ever seen though.... but, it wasn't really the point of the
show and I didn't really mind it, when APCs actually BURNED engines while approaching to land on a starship in the
opposite direction, as if they were landing in gravity and such...

I found a game - Universal Combat - that actually enables you to do almost everything you saw in SAAB.. Space, air,
land and naval combat.. Even has this slogan, like SAAB. I'm sure the author must have been influenced by SAAB. You
can be inside a vessel, fighter, shuttle, gunboat, ground vehicle, naval unit or in FIRST PERSON... the game IS rather
buggy and the graphics leaves much to be desired, but the concept is plainly brilliant. Check out some screenies.
http://www.3000ad.com/shots/uc.shtml

Last night, I executed a SAAB type of planet insertion. Launch a few shuttles.. have them land and deploy troops and
assault vehicles, have them dust off. The troops and vehicles move to secure an area.. Later have the shuttles drop
in and evac all units back to the carrier... NEAT I tell ya! Although when I tried it in a hostile environment, I lost like 2
of 4 shuttles with all hands.. a rather lame tactical performance

Cool, but rifle scopes do not zoom. They're fixed. They're not even cross-shaped, more like T-shaped. They almost
always get them wrong in movies.

Yeah.. I guess you have to have been a real soldier to know that. Mostly, zooming and crosshairs are there for the
drama of it.. Same thing with space fights.. dogfight maneuvers and LOUD explosions..? puh-leez ... but we all go
with it... I remember it actually HURT when I watched Armageddon as those two shuttles perfomed neck breaking
manuvers around the moon to catch up with the asteroid and then the ugly crash landing.. In real life, it would all
take AGES and would be really easily manageable

[/quote]
Now that we speak of it, cameras are cool and more sensors would be better. Maybe a radar, there is already a
proximity radar as standard and the Dragonfly and Helios have radars, but a true radar like the F/A-18's APG-73, with
multiple target detection. Not just for tactical stuff, mind you. A radar is always a useful thing to have...
[/quote]
Well, with the current functionality of Orbiter I'd have no use for a camera or a radar.. Then again, I don't think I
logged more than 2 hours in the Dragonfly On the other hand, since your vessel is usually the only actively moving
vessel, unless you're REALLY bored and get a kick out of jumping seats of 4 vessels every 10 seconds, you pretty
much know where everything is and will be in the next half hour.

Cheers

[DocHoliday]

hehehehe, I found them both Ghostrider!

The original:
http://www.cyberpursuits.com/heckifiknow/saab/vids/saab03.wmv

Wang's impression:
http://www.cyberpursuits.com/heckifiknow/saab/vids/saab27.wmv



Cheers,

[Ghostrider]

DocHoliday wrote:
hehehehe, I found them both Ghostrider!

Yeah!

Raise your hands all ye who have never mocked a superior officer only to turn around and find him staring icily at you.
^_^

[Ghostrider]

That doesn't sound like a bad way of living, but we both know, it wouldn't work that way

Mainly because all of our artistic production would be, like, "Beer good". D'oh!

Amen! You're only the third person I know, who watched and loved this show..   Seems like NOONE knows
about it.

There ARE some more, they're just difficult to find. Looks like someone told them to "Stay with the dead" or something.

I liked the ISSAPC though.. The Shuttle-A or Eagle reminds me a lot of those, but it's not quite the same

I liked the Shuttle-A and -A2 because they somehow resemble the Space: 1999 Eagle. That was one cool spacecraft.
Can't wait to have a fully functional Eagle with working panels (true to the original mid-1970 era panels) and big
honkin' laser.

I found a game - Universal Combat - that actually enables you to do almost everything you saw in SAAB..

Aw, the Dark Lord Derek Smart of BC3KAD is still around!

Although when I tried it in a hostile environment, I lost like 2 of 4 shuttles with all hands.. a rather lame
tactical performance

You should have "softened" the LZ with orbital bombardment and checked it out with a recon bird for BDA and enemy
strength before making landfall.

Yeah.. I guess you have to have been a real soldier to know that.

Which gives a totally different perspective on military-themed movies and TV-shows. AFAIK, only JAG and Stargate SG-
1 give some attention to proper military procedures and hardware.

In real life, it would all take AGES and would be really easily manageable

Provided you launch some decades in advance, but can you imagine a movie where some guy says: "look, there's
cometoid bound to impact Earth in 60 years" and someone else going "OK, guys, we've got 15 years to get the ball
rolling, so think fast". Hm, it wouldn't be popular even at the cinema d'essai.

Well, with the current functionality of Orbiter I'd have no use for a camera or a radar..

The camera is to take pretty pictures - I could use a screen grabber but it ain't the same, I like to look out of a
viewfinder.

As for the radar, what about doing some orbital speed traps (Speed Limit: c).

Then again, I don't think I logged more than 2 hours in the Dragonfly

I use the Dragonfly as a docking trainer or to have some panels ready (I hate using the keyboard shortcuts) when
flying the Clydesdale. Of course, I pilot the freighter through remote control.

On the other hand, since your vessel is usually the only actively moving vessel, unless you're REALLY bored
and get a kick out of jumping seats of 4 vessels every 10 seconds, you pretty much know where everything is and will
be in the next half hour.

If I could do this kind of stuff, I wouldn't be Ghostrider but Nightcrawler.

[Atom]

Stopped by armed gaurds tonight, oh yeah. They weren't happy to see us. See, we were on an exersice, stealth style, but the
thing is our Cadet squadron is on and active RAF training basic training camp. So you got armed gaurds with live ammo
walking around. We were sneaking down between a hedge and a fence, next to a road, when we were told to stop. But we did what
we were told, we stopped, told them who we were and showed them our ID.

They told a different story to their supiors, they claimed that were were in the small woods next to the base, and that we
failed to stop quick enough. So the person in cahrge calls our Warrent Officer who has a word with us, brilliant. Not our fault.

That was a rather pointless story, but it was cool when it happened, bloody terrorists have made the military jumpy.

[StarLost]

Doc,

Chock me up as another that liked the Chiggy von Richthofen scenes (though the show was not particularly original and too
much of the rah rah  Marine BS)

Ghostrider,

No zoom scopes on rifles and various reticles?  'Fraid you're wrong on this one.  Depends on the unit you're in.  In your
favour, I will admit that this type of sighting system is NOT general issue and is usually special ops. Zoom settings pitch
the scope wrt to the rifle to maintain consistent ballistics.

Atom,

SOP where reg. forces and cadets are concerned.  Someone was covering his ass, not yours.  

Military units are usually very good where kids are concerned (Scouts, Guides, Air Cadets, etc).  However, for Army Cadets
and some Navy Cadets, the relationship is sometimes close to schizoid.

[Atom]

I got a flying slot, after months waiting for one to come up. I generally can't go becasue I've been so many times. I'm happy.

[DocHoliday]

Aw, the Dark Lord Derek Smart of BC3KAD is still around!

heh, I see you've heard of him too. Well, he seems to behave around me. I logged onto his forum the other day and
the way I see it, he's just a bitter guy having been screwed around by publishers a lot.. Of course, he DOES have a
rather nasty character when you piss him off.. The banning rules on his forum are phenomenal. It's like a police
state But, you're warned from the start. Low tolerance for BS, and "this is OUR site" and "buying this game gives
you no extra rights".. In a way, that is a very brave attitude in another way it's rather suicidal commercially. For the
moment, I'll stick with the game and see how tech-support behaves

Starlost:
Heh, well, I noticed the series was more or less dedicated to people fighting in the Pacific in WWII.. Both sides.
Certain stories are direct interpretations of WW2 events. Take Sugar Dirt for example. I thought it was Midway
revisited.. The things I particularly liked about SAAB were that they created a rather realistic potential future (still
terrorism, still political intrigues, humans STILL not learning any lessons, by creating invitros and AIs, and finally
people STILL unable to make calm decisions, but instead jumping to conclusions and consequenctly war)... Also, even
though there is a lot of marine advertising.. there are also situations where it's all questioned or even mocked... Also
sometimes they incorporate the fact that the "other" side are just another version of "human" beings (both Japanese
in WW2 as well as Chigs - remember that scene when Hawks is off on a recon mission on a hostile planet watching a
bird.. and then watching a Chig watch the same bird - we are all the same).... That episode is also one of my
favourite as it shows the Orwell type education the invitros get Again, something this society is BOUND to do
somewhere in the future...

heh, I got a little carried away, but that show was just inspiring to me. The problem is in reality soldiers and COs are
rarely as disciplined and logical.. they are just humans... Invitros actually might be a good idea for the military.. If
they NEVER mingled with regular humans.. Emotional confusion is something you can't bypass in this case.

Atom:
I'm not sure I understood. You WERE on an exercise and you were stopped by guards.. why? They didn't know? Your
CO didn't explain later on? Instead you were told off... By the way you explained it seemed as if you were just doing
a mock exercise yourselves and got confused for "trespassers".. ?

Cheers,

[Ghostrider]

No zoom scopes on rifles and various reticles?  'Fraid you're wrong on this one.  Depends on the unit you're
in.  In your favour, I will admit that this type of sighting system is NOT general issue and is usually special ops. Zoom
settings pitch the scope wrt to the rifle to maintain consistent ballistics.

Yeah, I guess for instance anti-materiel heavies like the .50 Barrett rifle would have at least 2 mag settings. It's the
zoom factor that bothers me - real zoom or just a different mag setting? Anyway, I'm a groundpounder, not a specops
type. The SG-550-1 scope I was familiar with is fixed mag factor, with a T-shaped tritium-illuminated reticle, good
enough for general purpose sniping up to 600m away, with just windage and elevation settings. A "real" sniper scope
would need some more knobs to set distance, wind direction and speed, and you would need to adjust depending on
the round used.

Anyway, I liked the SIG scope - once on the 300m range we fitted some to our rifles and managed to bullseye our
targets with nary a miss. 20 shots rapid, a pity the automatic targets didn't take it well. If they get hit twice before
they have a chance to turn around and reset, they hang up. Half a minute after the first shot went downrange, the
targets were all "blue-screened". We simply packed up and ran...

[StarLost]

Ghostrider,

You still serving?  It's a fair piece back for me.  Ex-airforce, but with special duties 'cause I'm an archer and was stupid
enough to qualify shoot high enough to be made an instructor on our Base Defence Force.  Had a special little duty when the
Queen opened the Commonwealth Games in Edmonton, hence my exposure to some very neat little toys.

Made damned sure I "unqualified" the next year.

Can't say too much 'cause I'm still under oath, even after this much time, a point on which I was reminded by my youngest son
who is now an officer (for those who noted that I've talked about him in the past, he switched his career path from Army
(infantry) to Air Force. Go figure, but Daddy is extra proud).

Oh yeah, I forgot, real zoom not just mag point settings.  Mechanical linkage from zoom screw to an eccentric (actually a
pair) controlling elevation and to some extent windage compensation (though that was a separate control). Second eccentric
was for "red spot", if you take my meaning.

[DocHoliday]

*Doc reads with amazement* shop talk.. I'm damned if I understand half of it, but I sure feel cool reading this

[freespace2dotcom]

Keh!

I understand

almost

most of it.

I couldn't continue the conversation, except maybe mention a certain gun that won my heart due to it's easiness to
snipe seagulls. hehe.. I truely am a sadist..

*psg1 in Msg2* cough cough..

[DocHoliday]

Seagulls?! aw, man... true they have a nasty bite, but sniping them is overkill. Get 'em with your hands, you
coward!

[freespace2dotcom]

meh. you can't kill them with your hands in a video game!

[Atom]

Unless you got a game in which you have REALLY big hands.

[DocHoliday]

Ah *whew* so it was a game.. For a minute I thought you really got your hands on a psg1 and shot the crap out of
those birds.. I'd have to smack you then

[Atom]

My sister killed a duck with a stone when she was 4. Does that count?

[Ghostrider]

Atom wrote:
My sister killed a duck with a stone when she was 4. Does that count?

I slew a rooster with an anemometer at 13. Beat that!

[Ghostrider]

You still serving?  It's a fair piece back for me.

I'm in the Swiss Army - militia. I'm getting retired this year - not in the Blade Runneresque sense, hopefully.

Oh yeah, I forgot, real zoom not just mag point settings.

I'd like to see one myself - next time I go and visit my buddies "up above" the rank ladders, I'll check the new sniper
toys out. Can't wait to see the new Panzerfaust computer-assisted sight, though. I'm good enough with the standard
optical sight, but the new one is rumoured to be accurate against moving targets up to 600m. Awesome for a
shoulder fired, unguided ATW.

Ah, apologies for anyone who doesn't speak soldier. It's a grunt thing.